*DO IT* Changing rubber hoses $2058 every 5 years

[ussyorktown]

CTSW in for annual. FD says should change the pipes every 5 years. Pacific Northwest has no hard freezes and only a few days hot.

Rotax recommends that the Rubber Hose Replacement every 5 years for continued airworthiness. I have attached the Rotax documentation for your review.


Cost:
Rebuild Kit $ 1435.00 + ship (est. $23.00)
Labor 12 hours @ $ 50.00 hr.
Total: $ 2058.00

Is this something that can be deferred as Rotex "recommends" but does not mandate or require.

Posted later:
WOW! I saw a video that made me see that my life and my passenger's life is worth more than $2k. Watch this video! Esp. at :50 seconds into it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdlKl9hS ... e=youtu.be

[Super Cub]

The CTSW next to me just had the 5 year hose change and there is NO WAY that that job can be done in 12 hours!

[srhalter58]

I just did my Remos rubber replacement, my mehcanic used standard in stock parts for some items, I assisted and it took
2.5 days, costs below not including my time. I think it will go quicker next time...

Sun, Apr 1 2012 5 year Rubber Replacement April 1 2012 Maintenance -$1,470.46
Edit Sun, Apr 1 2012 Annual -April 1 2012 Maintenance -$732.35

[drseti]

"Recommends" is too weak a word, Dan. This is a mandatory service bulletin. (It's also false economy to try to defer this safety-related maintenance). As for the 12 hour estimate, it took me three full days of labor. And the $50/hr labor rate is a low-ball figure. I charge $65/hour, and around here that's considered cheap. (Thankfully, I don't have to pay myself.)

[ussyorktown]

Perry is a good mother to my CTSW. I'm sure he gave an honest estimate without having done it before.
REMEMBER MY ALERION COLLAPSE problem?
Perry saw that the stabalator in the very middle also has collapsed. WTF? Was it a bad batch as left aileron is collapsed, trim tab has a dimple collapse and now we see the middle of the stabelator.

I hope FD sees this as a major defect and doesn't want to tangle with me about "warranty of merchantability".
Dan, J.D.

[dstclair]

Paul - you are correct that this is a service bulletin but not that it is required as per the FARs. Only a Safety Alert/Directive is required and this particular item has not been elevated to that status by Flight Design (long discussion on ctflier.com) or any other manufacturer (that I know of). For my Sting there is an SB with strong language but also stipulates that failure to comply does not ground an aircraft if it has a current condition inspection.

That being said, the above doesn't mean it's not a good practice just that it is not legally required (based on my interpretation of the regs and each owner needs to make their own decision). I personally plan on having the service done at my upcoming annual.

FYI. This isn't just a Rotax recommendation -- Lycoming also recommends replacing the rubber components in their maintenance manual.

[designrs]

WOW! I saw a video that made me see that my life and my passenger's life is worth more than $2k. Watch this video! Esp. at :50 seconds into it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdlKl9hS ... e=youtu.be

Thanks Dan. I watched the video. Very dramatic, but this is all new to me. What exactly are we looking at in this video?

[ussyorktown]

My airplane's Mom (Perry the mechanic) asked me if I want to change the tubes and I said "Maybe we can defer it for another year."
This video shows a pipe that is 6.5 years old. It would be a bitch for such a failure a few hundred miles away from home over the Cascade Mountains. So I bit the bullet and told him to change the tubes now and not defer a year.

[3Dreaming]

Having done a few hose changes on the CT I know his estimate is low. Also at 5 years is a good time to replace the rubber motor mount bushings. The engine has to come off the airplane for this, and it makes the hose change easier.

[drseti]

at 5 years is a good time to replace the rubber motor mount bushings.

Agreed. I did mine.

The engine has to come off the airplane for this, and it makes the hose change easier.

That was not the case in my SportStar -- its motor mount bushings can be replaced without pulling the engine. You support the engine's weight, loosen all the motor mount bolts, and replace one at a time.

[drseti]

FYI. This isn't just a Rotax recommendation -- Lycoming also recommends replacing the rubber components in their maintenance manual.

In the case of the Lycoming IO-360 I owned for 30 years, the manual said check rubber at annual, replace on condition. I think a calendar interval makes more sense, as you can't really tell the internal condition of the hoses by inspecting them from the outside.

[dstclair]

Hi Paul -- the latest maintenance manual off the Lycoming website goes a bit further now on the hoses:

As airplanes and engines attain age, there appears to be a need to reemphasize the inspection or replacement of engine hoses or lines carrying fuel, oil or hydraulic fluid. The hose manufacturers definitely recommend regular inspection and replacement of all such hoses at engine overhaul even though they look good. Age limit of rubber-steel or fiber-banded hose has generally been established at four years. This limit of four years is generally considered to be “shelf” life.

..........

Lycoming Service Bulletin No. 509 must also be complied with if rubber hose is used to carry low-lead aviation gasoline. Aeroquip, the manufacturer of hose used by Lycoming, has recorded several failures of 601-type rubber hose. Although it is satisfactory for other purposes, this hose appears to be adversely affected by low-lead aviation gasoline. 601-type rubber hose used for low-lead aviation gasoline is to be replaced after no more than two years of use. Aeroquip and Lycoming recommend that rubber hose be replaced with Teflon hose

I found a 5 year interval statement in the Lycoming Overhaul manual as well.

[3Dreaming]

The engine has to come off the airplane for this, and it makes the hose change easier.

That was not the case in my SportStar -- its motor mount bushings can be replaced without pulling the engine. You support the engine's weight, loosen all the motor mount bolts, and replace one at a time.[/quote]

We are not so lucky on the CT. The bolts remove to the rear, and are to close to the firewall.

[CharlieTango]

I just did my hoses, mounts, wing inspection and chute repack.

after 5 years I did have a coolant hose that had wear, and the hose to the fuel valve was not properly fastened.

5 years seems right based on the condition of the old hoses.

[drseti]

Hi Paul -- the latest maintenance manual off the Lycoming website goes a bit further now on the hoses:

Thanks, Dave. That's quite an improvement over the old "inspect and replace on condition" language. When I took the Lycoming factory course (about 22 years ago), they didn't even discuss rubber replacement.