Established glide path

[designrs]

"Unable, student pilot / new pilot requests pattern"... would probably buy consideration at most Class-D airports that are not very busy... especially at a home field where they probably know the student and instructor as being reasonable people.

[MrMorden]

Thanks Andy. Apparently, I stand corrected, but I swear, I thought only communication was required in Class-D.

I think you are confusing ATC operations with the requirements to ENTER a class D. To enter an airport area requires:

Class B: Radio contact, a mode-C transponder, and a clearance

Class C: Radio contact and a mode-C transponder

Class D: Radio contact

You must *always* comply with ATC instructions if you are in an area that requires it. You can try saying "unable", but if ATC insists your only legal option for non-compliance is to declare an emergency.

Note that this does not apply to flight following outside an airport airspace area. In that case ATC is providing advisories only. They might suggest a course of action, but it's not required to comply. However, if you are on FF and are flying in a B, C, or D airspace, you'd better damn sure do what they say, since at that point you are "in an area in which air traffic control is exercised".

[designrs]

Of course the FAR is written "must comply in areas where ATC exercises control". This is so that they can justly prosecute any non-compliant and possibly hazardous pilot.

ATC does a great job in most cases, and are on the same team as pilots to keep everyone safe. However, we've all heard or seen some "stuff happen" occasionally. ATC is not perfect, they don't see everything, and at times they make mistakes... as do pilots.

Still, I wouldn't be quick to accept the "must comply" as 100%, especially outside of Class-B. The mentality of seeing ATC as "commanding" can be hazardous. It might often be proactive to view ATC instructions as "requests" and "usually the best option".

Many, many things are reasonably negotiable. Often all it takes is a polite request to make everyone safer.

[MrMorden]

Still, I wouldn't be quick to accept the "must comply" as 100%, especially outside of Class-B. The mentality of seeing ATC as "commanding" can be hazardous. It might often be proactive to view ATC instructions as "requests" and "usually the best option".

Many, many things are reasonably negotiable. Often all it takes is a polite request to make everyone safer.

I totally agree that you can make requests and often they are granted. But to view ATC instructions as "requests" in situations where the FARs give them authority is done at one's (and one's certificate's) own risk. The FAR says we "may not operate an aircraft contrary to ATC instructions"...that's pretty cut and dried. The emergency exemption exists for those situations where ATC instructions create a real hazard.

Feel free to ask for something different from what ATC instructs you to do. Just be clear it's you making a "request", not ATC.

[FastEddieB]

How does the addition of some power effect how far the airplane is going to travel? What about the removal of weight with the same power setting and airspeed?

I think we're far enough afield from the OP that a new thread on that topic might be appropriate.

I was just trying to correct the assumption, incorrectly held by pilots of all levels, that light planes glide farther than heavy ones, or the inverse.

[BrianL99]

I was just trying to correct the assumption, incorrectly held by pilots of all levels, that light planes glide farther than heavy ones, or the
inverse.

If there's anything I've learned in my short experience with LSA's, is they're much more sensitive to everything, than airplanes I've flown in the past.

Pilot input, wind, power, lack of power ... whatever forces can act on an airplane, does waaaaay more "acting" on an LSA.

[3Dreaming]

How does the addition of some power effect how far the airplane is going to travel? What about the removal of weight with the same power setting and airspeed?

I think we're far enough afield from the OP that a new thread on that topic might be appropriate.

I was just trying to correct the assumption, incorrectly held by pilots of all levels, that light planes glide farther than heavy ones, or the inverse.

If we had been talking about a power off glide, then I would have deserved the admonishment of your rant. You took the statement out of context with the question that the OP ask. You made the assumption that I meant power off glide, when I didn't.

I still stand by my statement, that if gliding with power like the OP stated that if you remove weight the airplane will fly farther if no other changes are made.

[MrMorden]

If there's anything I've learned in my short experience with LSA's, is they're much more sensitive to everything, than airplanes I've flown in the past.

Pilot input, wind, power, lack of power ... whatever forces can act on an airplane, does waaaaay more "acting" on an LSA.

That's a good way of looking at it, and true from my experience.

[rezaf_2000]

Hi everyone, thanks for all your input. This week, due to the super nice calm weather a bit unusual to midwest, I flew everyday, with a 3 solo days. I think I finally got it. The trick for me was to leave a bit more power in, and make a slightly wider pattern. This way, I have more time in each leg of the pattern (abeam the numbers, base, final) to identify and correct any inconsistencies.

I hope the weather cooperates next week too, although the forecast looks iffy.

[Merlinspop]

Hi everyone, thanks for all your input. This week, due to the super nice calm weather a bit unusual to midwest, I flew everyday, with a 3 solo days. I think I finally got it. The trick for me was to leave a bit more power in, and make a slightly wider pattern. This way, I have more time in each leg of the pattern (abeam the numbers, base, final) to identify and correct any inconsistencies.

I hope the weather cooperates next week too, although the forecast looks iffy.

Great to hear! Now... work to make that 'slightly wider pattern' slightly narrower. Resist the temptation to go ever wider and wider. You don't get credit for cross country flights no matter how big the pattern is. Work to be more efficient and quick in your cockpit chores such that you're way in front of the plane instead of behind it.

Congrats on your progress and keep it going!

[3Dreaming]

Hi everyone, thanks for all your input. This week, due to the super nice calm weather a bit unusual to midwest, I flew everyday, with a 3 solo days. I think I finally got it. The trick for me was to leave a bit more power in, and make a slightly wider pattern. This way, I have more time in each leg of the pattern (abeam the numbers, base, final) to identify and correct any inconsistencies.

I hope the weather cooperates next week too, although the forecast looks iffy.

Back to your original post, my choice would to have used less power and the same pattern your instructor taught you.

[BrianL99]

Hi everyone, thanks for all your input. This week, due to the super nice calm weather a bit unusual to midwest, I flew everyday, with a 3 solo days. I think I finally got it. The trick for me was to leave a bit more power in, and make a slightly wider pattern. This way, I have more time in each leg of the pattern (abeam the numbers, base, final) to identify and correct any inconsistencies.

I hope the weather cooperates next week too, although the forecast looks iffy.

Back to your original post, my choice would to have used less power and the same pattern your instructor taught you.

You may not be there yet, but my advice would be to strive to make every solo landing, a "power off" landing. 2 reasons:

1. You'll get much better at controlling airspeed, which is critical in an LSA (or most any airplane for that matter).

2. You'll know exactly how to land, should you ever find yourself without power.


An Instructor at the field I fly out of, makes every solo landing that way. A few months ago, he lost an engine in a DA40 and dead sticked into K9B1 without breaking a sweat. K9B1 has about 1000' of usable runway and he had one chance at it.