best IFR LSA

[email protected] · Post by **[email protected]** » Wed Aug 12, 2009 1:35 am

Hello all. I am curious which IFR certified LSA you would recommend. I am interested in purchasing an LSA to use not only for recreational reasons, but also to give instruction in. IFR certification is a must for me for not only the convenience of being able to fly ifr flight plans, but also to give instrument instruction in. Really the only LSA that i am familiar with is the evektor sportstar that is now available for instrument flying. I would love to hear what else is out there and what you would recommend and why you would recommend it. I have attempted to search the internet for options based on what I am looking for, however the lsa market seems to focus on vfr flying. What attracts me to possibly purchasing an lsa is the cost of ownership and the low cost of operation. Thank you to all that contribute.

N117FA · Post by **N117FA** » Wed Aug 12, 2009 6:46 am

You may wish to contact me regarding my experiences flying an IFR SLSA.

Thank you,
Younis Forsyth
Forsyth Aviation
http://www.ForsythAviation.us

[email protected] wrote:Hello all. I am curious which IFR certified LSA you would recommend. I am interested in purchasing an LSA to use not only for recreational reasons, but also to give instruction in. IFR certification is a must for me for not only the convenience of being able to fly ifr flight plans, but also to give instrument instruction in. Really the only LSA that i am familiar with is the evektor sportstar that is now available for instrument flying. I would love to hear what else is out there and what you would recommend and why you would recommend it. I have attempted to search the internet for options based on what I am looking for, however the lsa market seems to focus on vfr flying. What attracts me to possibly purchasing an lsa is the cost of ownership and the low cost of operation. Thank you to all that contribute.

[email protected] · Post by **[email protected]** » Wed Aug 12, 2009 11:56 am

I looked at your website a little bit. I read the part where you say the rotax 912 ul/uls can not be approved for IFR, but i know there are rotax powered airplanes out there flying ifr right now. I'm confused. Can you give me more information or possibly an email address to learn more about what it is you know that i don't? Thanks!

[email protected]

N117FA · Post by **N117FA** » Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:35 pm

Rotax offers a certified version known as the 912s that is approved for IFR. This engine is identical to the 912uls but every part installed is documented in accordance with FAR33 procedures and a price premium is charged to account for this process. The certified engine can be identified by a red data tag. Manufacturer's standard installation on a SLSA will be the 912uls engine.

My contact info is on my website. I will be unavailable for a few days but will get back to you when I return.

[email protected] wrote:I looked at your website a little bit. I read the part where you say the rotax 912 ul/uls can not be approved for IFR, but i know there are rotax powered airplanes out there flying ifr right now. I'm confused. Can you give me more information or possibly an email address to learn more about what it is you know that i don't? Thanks!

[email protected]

dstclair · Post by **dstclair** » Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:01 pm

I don't believe you're going to find too many opinions on flying real IFR in an S-LSA since the standard doesn't currently exist. There is a draft standard that is likely to be adopted in the (near?) future but it's not there yet. AMD took a different stance on the existing standards and claim to be certified IFR (I'm not offering an opinion one way or the other as to AMD's correctness) so Zodiacs are probably the only ones with legal, real-world experiences.

That being said it looks like there will be a standard and I'd expect all the players to have IFR versions of their planes available ASAP after adoption. I'm sure you could call any of them and the will build one to the draft standard (as Evektor does) today. You're taking the risk that it meets the 'real' standard, though.

That brings up what flight characterists you need to support your mission. This can be settled by flying the current crop of S-LSA's since IFR equippage won't change the flight characteristics. I'd suggest going under the hood and flighing in light-moderate turbulence and determine which plane(s) are the most stable and require the least workload.

If you're mission is training and filing IFR (in VFR conditions), then any number of aircaft fit the bill. Flying 'real' IFR might change your opinion.

Now for my opinion. I own an S-LSA that I absolutely love and think it is the best plane ever built

My prior plane was a Bellanca Super Viking and I flew 'real' IFR frequently. The airplane provided a very stable platform, 3300 lbs gross weight didn't hurt, and was easily manageable by a single pilot (along with the AP). I may be getting old, but I would never fly the same conditions in my current aircraft. 1320lbs even with an AP is going to a lot to handle in the bumps. I think a couple hours would wear you out. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure my plane can handle real IFR conditions but would not be my first choice for this type of mission. I would probably look outside of S-LSA's if this was my primary mission.

For me, I'd only look for an IFR S-LSA to punch through a layer, fly on top, the run an approach. That would actually be a lot of fun!

stardust · Post by **stardust** » Thu Aug 13, 2009 5:33 am

The Evektor SportStar Max IFR offered demo flights during Oshkosh. It is fully capable of IMC flight using the IFR certified components required by the FAA. Rotax 912S engine, Warp Drive prop, TruTrak EFIS and EMS and autopilot, backup generator, battery, horizon, heated dual pitot/static, Garmin 430, and electrical bonded skin and control surfaces. A test flight has been conducted by EAA Sport Pilot and will appear in a near future article.
This plane is also available for demo flights at the Melbourne International Airport (MLB) in Florida.
Check out www.evektor-aircraft.com

tadel001 · Post by **tadel001** » Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:38 am

The correct language is IFR equipped aircraft. There is no IFR airplane certification. Part 23 aircraft have type certified equipment for IFR purposes. There is certain equipment that needs to be certified, i.e. transponder certs. The limitations really come from the manufacturer of the aircraft and its components.

Tecnam has been building IFR equipped and capable plane for years. Long before the LSA rule came into effect. You can currently get their LSA models IFR configured. I don't think you will see all LSA models offer IFR aircraft. Without having the experience, the liability is too much.

If you are interested, I have a new IFR Sierra for sale. Equipped with Garmin 530, Dual Advanced Flight Systems, Garmin 496, Garmin SL30, Garmin 327, and much much more.

Good luck!

[email protected] · Post by **[email protected]** » Thu Aug 13, 2009 7:35 am

I may be interested in the aircraft you have for sale. I am very familiar with the g430 and having a 530 is a huge plus. I would love to learn more about your aircraft if you would like to email me more information or a link to a web advertisement for it with price. Thanks!

tadel001 · Post by **tadel001** » Thu Aug 13, 2009 3:45 pm

I am putting together the web flyer on the aircraft today and tomorrow. The plane has:

Sensinich Prop
Dual Advanced Flight System
Garmin 530
Garmin 330
Garmin SL30
Garmin Audio Panel
Garmin 496
Trio Pro-Pilot Autopilot
Co2 alert system
BAck up battery system
Aux Alternator

Everything is wired together to work together, i.e. aircraft info from 330 displays on 530 and dual advanced flight system moving map. Auto-pilot tracks 530, etc.

$170K for the aircraft. This is probably the most capbably equipped IFR LSA out there. Plane has less than 50 hours on it.

[email protected] · Post by **[email protected]** » Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:00 pm

It does sound like the nicest ifr lsa ever put together, but also probably the most expensive lsa ever put together. that is far more than i was looking to spend, but thank you for the info. I guess I should have figured that when you said it had 530's.

tech10002 · Post by **tech10002** » Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:21 pm

The IFR Sportstar is about the same money. They hadn't set an exact price when I was playing with the one at Sun N Fun, by they said expect around 165k. Here's some high res pics of the one at Sun N Fun.

http://rides.webshots.com/album/571364526fIqMwk

My instructor was the Evektor dealer there at the booth and doing demo rides, so I got to take a pretty close look at it. It's a really nice looking plane--a lot nicer than the 07 model I can rent locally. I wish I could afford it.

tadel001 · Post by **tadel001** » Sun Aug 16, 2009 2:53 pm

Here is the video on the plane.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOo89eb_sXo

Bill · Post by **Bill** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:10 pm

I got to see this aircraft "up close and personal" just last week. It is, indeed, an attractive and impressively equipped plane. I also have a couple hours logged in a Tecnam Sierra (not this one, however). Being nimble yet stable, it is a joy to fly.

[email protected] · Post by **[email protected]** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:52 pm

I am sure that it is a great airplane, however I was not looking to spend that much and if i was I would be buying new. I don't doubt that it is worth what you are asking, but it's not for me.

rfane · Post by **rfane** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:57 pm

[email protected] wrote:I am sure that it is a great airplane, however I was not looking to spend that much and if i was I would be buying new. I don't doubt that it is worth what you are asking, but it's not for me.

New IFR aircraft cost alot of money. Those Garmin 430's and 530's are certainly not cheap.

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