Sport Pilot Talk

MovingOn wrote:Two or three sectionals probably weigh less than an ounce or two. I would never want to call ATC and ask for vectors because I don't have a workable chart, either electronic or paper.

I would not want to, but I would in the event of complete failure. It's not like you have to feel embarrassed when are are meeting the regs and need assistance due to equipment failures , that's why we pay those guys! That said, what is the real probability of BOTH an iPad and a 496, each with hard wire power and internal battery, failing? I'd say significantly less that 1 in 1000. In the event of a GPS satellite outage, I can still use the iPad to look at charts and it will have my approximate last known position still in it.

I'm comfortable with the level of redundancy I have.

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MovingOn wrote:It's not a matter of being embarrassed. I think you're safe with your redundancy. I simply choose to keep a paper chart in my flight bag.

And I respect that.

Nomore767 wrote:Isn't an iPad with all the sectionals better than fiddling with a paper chart, keeping it current and paying more $$ for it?

Some apps will even superimpose your position onto the sectional which you can also zoom.

Not that I've done it , but it seems like a good way to go in this digital/glass world.

In January of 2013 my wife and I jumped into a P92 and took off for a sightseeing flight in a direction we had never been before. The temperature at ground level was -6F. We were 20 minutes into the flight when we discovered the cabin heat didn't work. Then we flew into horrible turbulence and had to climb to 6,000 + ft where the OAT was -27F to get out of the turbulence. After an hour we decided this was no fun at all and turned back. Then all the electronics in the plane stopped working. The Garmin, the radio stack, even my Nexus 7, all the electronic displays quit because of the cold. The radio still worked, you just couldn't see what frequency it was set to.
Light Sport avionics are NOT as robust as other aircraft.
Out came the paper map, the plotter and the E6B, and we flew home.
Old school ain't cool, but it works every time.

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Since my paper is a backup to my backup to my backup, I go with WACs which cover a lot more area and are 'current' for a year. Few would need more than 2 to handle even longer cross countries.

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Just realize that WACS give up a lot if detail, some of which would be very relevant to a Light Sport pilot.

Might be OK as an emergency backup, but in a real emergency it might not show a small, private airport which could be suitable.

Edited to add: just went over to SkyVector to compare, and they're more detailed than I remember them. Still, no frequencies shown for non-towered airports, and smaller private strips don't show at all.

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Within that group which uses a tablet for flight planning + in-cockpit nav, I suspect a sizeable subset of us already have a single back-up. If not a compatible smart phone with the same software running, then perhaps a paper chart. And these two sources are in addition to whatever our a/c is already outfitted with - e.g. a portable or installed GPS/nav capability of some sort with its own data base.

Personally, after using Foreflight for two years and multiple across-the-country and regional flights, I can't imagine a paper chart being my *preferred* back-up. If I was doing more local-only flights, I would feel differently. So...if I only had my one tablet to rely on, my 'back-up' would probably be an aux battery for that tablet.

I remember frustrating an instructor during a BFR. The gentleman I will call old school regarding technology and flat out refused to use it. But as he probed questions I keep referring to the avionics and finally he got irritated and this conversation followed: (shortened version)

Instructor, “You lost your electrical systems”
My response, “I have a backup power for 30 min enough to get down”
Instructor, “I mean the screen went dead”
My response, “Ok I will use the steam gauges and the GPS.
Instructor, “It fried the electrical system and the screen on your EFIS.
My response, “ The Garmin 796 is on battery.
Instructor, as he got more frustrated said “humor me the GPS is dead also.
My response was, “ Ok Look out the plane and fly, with that said I have steam gauges, and I haven’t even open the door for using my iPad. The iPad is not connected to the planes power or systems for failure, so it is isolated from failure from the plane. Furthermore before you go there, what if I lose power to the iPad or it is dead because I forgot to charge it, I would use my smart phone for with the same software.

His response was finally, "I give 4 or 5 redundant systems is more than enough for a Sport pilot."

After we landed I did comment I also have a current sectional in my bag

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CTLSi wrote:. , , "How many layers of backup does one need?" . . .

That's a good question.

CTLSi wrote:. . . "I have two Dynon Skyviews, and a Garmin 796. Thats three levels for sectionals." . . .

With a total electrical failure (including the backup batteries), what is the navigational backup for that?" . . .

CTLSi wrote: . . . "The radio is single point of failure so a handheld makes sense, at least for long cross country flights." . . .

Agree, but range is usually limited with those devices. Personally, besides the handheld radio, coming across those southern Rockies, I chose to use an iPad Air (with external GPS antenna), in addition to the SkyViews and an old antiquated, in panel, Garmin 396. They all worked great.

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