Sport Pilot Talk

From the August AOPA Pilot Colt article there are a few more details. The Colt-S is the base model and will have a base price of $156 k. The higher end Colt-SL which was flown for the test and has a ballistic parachute and 2-axis autopilot will be priced at $167 k as tested. The useful load of the SL as tested is 485 pounds. The useful load of the S isn't listed, but without the parachute and autopilot will probably be 40 or 50 pounds more. Rate of climb at sea level is 800 fpm at gross, and 75% cruise speed is 110 KTAS.

Scooper wrote:From the August AOPA Pilot Colt article there are a few more details. The Colt-S is the base model and will have a base price of $156 k. The higher end Colt-SL which was flown for the test and has a ballistic parachute and 2-axis autopilot will be priced at $167 k as tested. The useful load of the SL as tested is 485 pounds. The useful load of the S isn't listed, but without the parachute and autopilot will probably be 40 or 50 pounds more. Rate of climb at sea level is 800 fpm at gross, and 75% cruise speed is 110 KTAS.

IMHO . . . for what you are getting, this airplane is too expensive.

Wm.Ince wrote: IMHO . . . for what you are getting, this airplane is too expensive.

For perspective, the Sky Arrow I bought new in 2007 for $75.5k is now roughly double that, albeit with some minor upgrades.

“Too expensive” sadly seems to be par for the course these days.

FastEddieB wrote:For perspective, the Sky Arrow I bought new in 2007 for $75.5k is now roughly double that, albeit with some minor upgrades.
“Too expensive” sadly seems to be par for the course these days.

What were your reasons for "buying new?"

Wm.Ince wrote:

Scooper wrote:From the August AOPA Pilot Colt article there are a few more details. The Colt-S is the base model and will have a base price of $156 k. The higher end Colt-SL which was flown for the test and has a ballistic parachute and 2-axis autopilot will be priced at $167 k as tested. The useful load of the SL as tested is 485 pounds. The useful load of the S isn't listed, but without the parachute and autopilot will probably be 40 or 50 pounds more. Rate of climb at sea level is 800 fpm at gross, and 75% cruise speed is 110 KTAS.

IMHO . . . for what you are getting, this airplane is too expensive.

Would you, as a Flight Design owner, consider a new CTLS too expensive at $157,900?

http://flightdesignusa.com/aircraft/ctl ... g-options/

As far as new vs. used, it's buyer's choice. If you're throwing new vs. used into the equation it's an apples to oranges comparison.

FWIW, I bought my Zodiac SLSA used with less than 100 hours total time for $49,500. The original owner was a retired 85 year old ATP who had lost his medical and was in declining health, so he rarely flew it.

Zodiac LSA prices have never really recovered after the wing flutter debacle 10 years ago.

You can get them for about half the price as other, similarly configured LSAs - makes for a pretty good deal if you are ok with owning an experimental.

As far as I know, there have been no accidents since the redesign but a lot of people won’t touch them simply because of the way the company handled the original problem ...

Wm.Ince wrote: What were your reasons for "buying new?"

Because I could?

Seriously, I had just sold a 2003 Cirrus SR22, so I had some discretionary cash. The SR22 was a great plane, but $200/hr - or more - all in was getting to be a bit much in retirement and more than we needed. It had been bought as a factory demo, so I didn’t do too badly on depreciation. Not much in the way of used S-LSA Sky Arrows in 2007 anyway, so new made sense. I’ve had it for 12 years so far, and I wouldn’t be surprised if I still own it when it turns 20. And speaking of depreciation, as new prices keep going up, used prices tend to keep pretty firm - I recently saw a virtual twin of my plane with the owner asking $69.9k, albeit still S-LSA (not E-LSA) and about half the hours.

https://www.aerotrader.com/listing/2007 ... 5007399101


I often buy used stuff, and have had good luck doing so. The difference between used and new diminishes when you tend to keep things a long time. Our 2005 Honda Element was bought new, but after 14 years is still rolling along. A BMW motorcycle bought new 20 years ago and still going strong.

But once in a while new is nice.

Warmi wrote:Zodiac LSA prices have never really recovered after the wing flutter debacle 10 years ago.

You can get them for about half the price as other, similarly configured LSAs - makes for a pretty good deal if you are ok with owning an experimental.

As far as I know, there have been no accidents since the redesign but a lot of people won’t touch them simply because of the way the company handled the original problem ...

Yep; I completely agree. The way Chris Heintz handled the rash of fatal accidents added to the negative P.R. generated by the accidents themselves. The company almost went under.

To be clear, there have been several accidents, some fatal, involving Zodiacs since the 2010 structural upgrades, but the structural integrity of the airframes wasn't identified as contributing to the probable cause of any of them.

If I was in the market for another aircraft, and I may be in the future, I would love to purchase a new LSA. That might not be the smartest financial decision, but some decisions are more than financial. I love the idea of owning a new aircraft that has never been abused or experienced damage or hard landings, etc.

FastEddieB wrote:

Wm.Ince wrote: What were your reasons for "buying new?"

. . . . I had just sold a 2003 Cirrus SR22, so I had some discretionary cash. The SR22 was a great plane, but $200/hr - or more - all in was getting to be a bit much in retirement and more than we needed. It had been bought as a factory demo, so I didn’t do too badly on depreciation. Not much in the way of used S-LSA Sky Arrows in 2007 anyway, so new made sense. I’ve had it for 12 years so far, and I wouldn’t be surprised if I still own it when it turns 20. And speaking of depreciation, as new prices keep going up, used prices tend to keep pretty firm - I recently saw a virtual twin of my plane with the owner asking $69.9k, albeit still S-LSA (not E-LSA) and about half the hours.

I often buy used stuff, and have had good luck doing so. The difference between used and new diminishes when you tend to keep things a long time. Our 2005 Honda Element was bought new, but after 14 years is still rolling along. A BMW motorcycle bought new 20 years ago and still going strong.

Thank you.

FastEddieB wrote:But once in a while new is nice.

Concur.

The Colt looks nice. I’m hoping TAF announces the High Wing they have been working on at AirVenture. I was told a prototype is already flying. I would have thought there would be a spy photo or two by now. I’m not interested, just curious. I’m very happy with my Sling 2.

Sling 2 Pilot wrote:The Colt looks nice. I’m hoping TAF announces the High Wing they have been working on at AirVenture. I was told a prototype is already flying. I would have thought there would be a spy photo or two by now. I’m not interested, just curious. I’m very happy with my Sling 2.

Any word on the new 915is installation for Sling 2 ( the 1530 lbs version ) ?

I have no need for a 4 seater but a 1500 lbs gross Sling 2 with the new Rotax would be just about perfect for me ...

Wm.Ince wrote:Thank you.[

You’re welcome.

And not to be morbid, but at my age any vehicle purchase, be it plane, car or motorcycle, could end up being my last. Due to health issues, or, you know, that other thing.

It’s a balance. You certainly don’t want to outlive your money. On the other hand, at some point, it’s a matter of, “If not now, when?”

FastEddieB wrote:You certainly don’t want to outlive your money. On the other hand, at some point, it’s a matter of, “If not now, when?”

Or . . . "you can't take it with you."

Warmi wrote:

Sling 2 Pilot wrote:The Colt looks nice. I’m hoping TAF announces the High Wing they have been working on at AirVenture. I was told a prototype is already flying. I would have thought there would be a spy photo or two by now. I’m not interested, just curious. I’m very happy with my Sling 2.

Any word on the new 915is installation for Sling 2 ( the 1530 lbs version ) ?

I have no need for a 4 seater but a 1500 lbs gross Sling 2 with the new Rotax would be just about perfect for me ...

I know you can get it with the 914 in both versions, haven’t heard of them offering the 915. I would think they would have to modify the airframe like they did with the Sling TSi. Although the TSi looks like a Sling 4, it’s different.