Tailwheel endorsement

[jetcat3]

Warmi,

Glad you’re enjoying it. I’m almost done with my tailwheel endorsement in a Kitfox S7 but have since put lessons on hold until all of this blows over.

I noticed heavy and not as precise controls when flying the Outback Shock (Shock Cub) as compared to the near perfect handling of the P2008. By the way, there’s one in the Chicago area. With that said, I’m excited to see what the Norden will bring as it is all pushrod for the ailerons and I believe the elevator too. The Rans S-21 Outbound is the nicest handling taildragger I’ve flown yet.

What year is that Cub you’re flying?

[Warmi]

I am flying a 2008 Savage Classic model.

The “flying like a barn door” expressions I used , actually came from the flight school owner and I thought it perfectly described the way Zlin differed from my Sting or a Remos ( which is another aircraft this school is using )

[jetcat3]

I am flying a 2008 Savage Classic model.

The “flying like a barn door” expressions I used , actually came from the flight school owner and I thought it perfectly described the way Zlin differed from my Sting or a Remos ( which is another aircraft this school is using )

Haha, that’s funny. I’ve honestly felt that way about most of the Super Cub clones and it’s a little disappointing if you’re coming from a sportier LSA.

[3Dreaming]

I think it is just a Cub thing, they don't have sprightly handling. Most of the early 2 seat light airplanes that I have flown were like that, though some are more balanced on the controls. Most do have considerable adverse yaw.

[Sling 2 Pilot]

PS. Sling Pilot
I was told I could get the endorsement in about 5-6 hours ( $130 per hour ) but if I want to solo in it ( which I want ), I will need 10 hours due to insurance requirements.

Zlin.jpg

Thanks Warmi,

Like others here I flew Tailwheel planes (J3) as a kid and technically am grandfathered for tailwheel A/C. However, my logs from that era are long gone. I was giving considerable thought to purchasing a Searey before finally sticking to tri-cycle geared planes. The several places I went to for the sign off, wanted ridiculous $$$, even with past experience. Also, insurance carriers wanted you to take a 13 hour Searey specific course, which didn’t cover tailwheel endorsement, but could be added for additional charge. BS!

When I did my demo of the Searey, it was done over 2 days, several hours each day, it was a dream to fly. I got 20 full landings and splash and goes on water and I did a handful of airport landings. My Tailwheel landings were easy compared to the J3 and a Pitts S2 I flew years ago. The Pitts, was, well, the Pitts.

[Warmi]

Another lesson ... still trying to get used to how mushy controls are compared to my Sting - this generally means problems over-controlling the plane but eventually will get there (hopefully )

https://youtu.be/RHzxSZPYdF8

[drseti]

Several things stand out in this video, Warmi. First, I see an awful lot of rapid stick motion - as though you're rowing the boat. Try for steady pressure rather than constant motion. Related to this, I see your right hand clutching the stick grip rather tightly. This often leads to over-controlling, so try a lighter touch. But most important, in the first landing, I can clearly see your feet, and they don't move at all. I believe this is the primary cause of any difficulties you are experiencing - in Cubs (and Cub clones) I expect to see a lot of dancing on those rudder pedals. It is you feet, rather than your right hand, that will keep you aligned with the runway.

Talk this over with your CFI, of course, but in my experience, for best results in a taildragger you should be foot-flying, rather than hand-flying.

I'd be interested in seeing what Fast Eddie and 3Dreaming have to say, as they are both very experienced taildragger instructors.

[FastEddieB]

Glad you're still having fun!

I agree with the professor - I think your feet should be moving a lot more, with lots of little corrections.

And on the last landing, its hard to tell but it looks like you did not keep the stick all the way back after landing. Relaxing is a natural tendency, but keeping that stick back is important. I've seen some hellacious swerves after a nearly perfect landing when the student relaxed back pressure right after touching down.

The mental image I go for is to "feel for the runway" with the tailwheel. In most of the taildraggers I've flown and instructed in, the very best landings tend to have the tailwheel roll on slightly first, with the mains then dropping maybe a couple of inches as the stick comes all the way back. When all three touch at the same time, it just seems the plane gets a little "nervous" for a spell as there's still just a tad of lift left.

But you appear to be doing fine - it will all click soon. Have you gotten to wheel landing yet?

[drseti]

Relaxing is a natural tendency, but keeping that stick back is important.

Agreed. (That was the fourth thing I meant to say!)

[Warmi]

Yeah, the stick waving is mostly because the plane has very soft and delayed response to controls input , especially during slow flight, which makes me feel being behind it all the time.

I am pretty sure this is due to having 230+ hours in the last 3 years exclusively in my Sting which can be flown with fingertips , and even during slow flight is relatively crisp in its responses.

As far as rudder pedals , yeah, working on getting that going , especially on the ground

Pretty much all my landings were so far wheel landings with the stick a bit forward to keep rolling on the wheels and then waiting for the tail drop but yes keeping the stick back afterwards is a habit I will have to learn.

[FastEddieB]

Yeah, the stick waving is mostly because the plane has very soft and delayed response to controls input , especially during slow flight, which makes me feel being behind it all the time.

I don't have a problem with the stick "waving" around. I think its better to overcontrol when learning a new skill to get the desired effect. Smoothness can come later. I think I feel that way because as a student I tended to undercontrol, which drove my instructor mad.

[3Dreaming]

I really hate to offer advice on an airplane which I have never flown. Definitely the feet looked like they were asleep, not just on the landings, but flying in general. You need to wake them up. It looked a little windy and gusty, which leads to nervousness, especially in an airplane with which you are not familiar. This leads to tensing up on the control stick, which leads to the rapid movements. I have yet to find an airplane where rapid movements on the stick are required to fly it. You need to relax a little and loosen the grip on the control stick. I have often considered making a thumb tack studded control stick grip with an area just large enough for the thumb and a couple fingers, to force not over gripping the controls. Also likely if you were to use your feet a little more you could use less aileron with better results. One thing to watch is when flying around if you move the stick to one side and the nose moves the other way, like the start of a slip, you are not using enough rudder with the application of ailerons. Next time out while at altitude try rolling the airplane left and right (30° bank) while trying to keep the nose pointed at the same spot. Some will call this a Dutch Roll. It is a good exercise to get your feet and hands working together.

[drseti]

I really hate to offer advice on an airplane which I have never flown.

I agree, and also have never flown a Zlin, but I was assuming it flies pretty much like a Cub (which I have flown). If that assumption is incorrect, please feel free to disregard all my advice!

[Warmi]

Yeah, I was a bit death gripping that stick, no question about it - didn't even realize it

I generally don't grip the stick at all ... here is one my of landings in the Sting with pretty stiff crosswind.
https://youtu.be/9AXHo99Ig0w

The Sting has very light controls and I can fly it with just three fingers - looking at the video in the Sting and to your point about rapid stick movements, when it gets windy and gusty , I tend to work the stick quite a bit , I don't know what else I could do given that I am trying to maintain certain bank and being shifted left and right.

Perhaps, I am working it a lot more than necessary , would you consider this video above over controlling ?

[drseti]

when it gets windy and gusty , I tend to work the stick quite a bit , I don't know what else I could do given that I am trying to maintain certain bank and being shifted left and right.

You can probably achieve the desired effect by holding the stick relatively stationary, and making those quick adjustments with just the rudder.

I know you were probably taught that the ailerons roll the wing, and the rudder corrects for adverse yaw. But, here's an alternate way of thinking: rudder yaws the nose, and ailerons correct for adverse roll.